Thursday, November 08, 2007

“End of Welfare”.

I see that £30 billion taken from the Suburbs are injected towards improving life in the inner Cities has had , according to Policy Exchange , had no effect whatsoever. In fact there was a widening gap in personal income and unemployment levels life expectancy and the usual markers.
Whilst I lived in Islington I noticed that dependency culture had much to do with the intractability of such problems and in particular the Council housed population for whom work involved massive marginal. Spraying money at the weed will only make it deeper rooted
Years ago all this was predicted by Frank Field who began to think beyond welfare . He was , as we know , stymied and ejected by Gordon Brown whose collectivist vision is oil to reforms water.At the moment we have ample assistance to find a job but while the carrot is in place ,there is no stick .That is does not work will suprise only polticians of the left.
Eyes have tuned to the ‘Wisconsin miracle ‘. The star of welfare reform was Governor Tommy Thompson, ...He said

“Welfare reform in Wisconsin began with one simple premise: Every person is capable of doing something. The challenge for government is to help people go from doing nothing to doing something. If we are going to invest money as a society or as a state to help poor families, it makes sense to invest it in ways that will help them enter the workforce and become self-sufficient—instead of sending checks out once a month and in effect just walking away from their needs. To me, the latter is not compassion. Expecting nothing in return and offering no real help is hardly compassionate. That is apathy.”

The vital component is that there is a limit to the time you have at the states expense. Enter, Mr. Stick. Its success has transformed debate across America . There they talk about the “End of Welfare”. The reaction of Cameron and Brown will be the fault line between them . Gordon Brown is known to be dismissive, preferring to spend the tax payers money on means tested hand outs . Cameron , we assume is cautiously interested especially in the context of Iain Duncan Smiths work on out broken society. The rub will be how to empower voluntary organisations to pick up the ultra needy who cannot be left to starve .
I doubt myself that a scheme can be simply transferred from the States to this country. Tax credits for example came from the US but has been a disaster because people here do not understand how to fill in returns and on the other hand understand all to well how to use the system especially the housing system. By working 16 hours you can get a total of £25,000 thereabouts through rent payment and the benefits associated and all that happens is that cheap part time Labour is subsidised by the tax Payer. What a waste of time and the delivery was catastrophic as we know .

I suspect that the property factor, attitudes to independence and the sheer number of state serfs will make it exceedingly difficult to begin solving our self inflicted sicky. In America it took a consensus to bring about reform and I worry that there are far too many vested interests in keeping the poor , poor , for that in the old world.

17 comments:

Daisy said...

there is a significant problem with the way america is now doing it...instead of being on a case by case basis...everyone is on the same system...you can have benefits for 5 years for your entire life...some people expended this time frame right away as they were not educated about it and were not given opportunities to get out of this system they were raised in...that is apathy...we now have a growing homeless situation that is primarily women and children and it is sickening...one person gets an idea without thinking it all the way through...without providing education to those who are only used to living a system which their families have grown up in and have learned that it is their way of life...while i think they should be making their own way...i do believe when you raise a society in one way of thinking you have to educate them in another when you decide to change it on them...remember most of the people in america on this benefit have low if any education and are usually mothers with children...also...5 years over an entire lifetime is not much time at all...especially as the society itself flexuates so much...from birth to death...it is a limited resource that some are truly in need of...where does the societal conscious lie...where is the responsibility? yet we are more than willing to give this opportunity now to ILLEGAL IMMIGRANTS...yes people who have come into the country illegally can get this money but it is limited to the LEGAL citizens...so when you talk about the great american society...it does have it's drawbacks...just ask a real american...they will be honest about it because we are not running for office and have no reason to lie to the public...
sorry about the rant...you picked something which is unnerving to me and i really did drink too much coffee today...

Newmania said...

Not at all Daisy ,I am decidely uncertain of importing ideas form one country to another. I should have been clearer that I do not presume this is the answer...although we do have to sdo something about dependency

Daisy said...

newmania...i was not stating you as "the people making decisions" i leave that honor to the politicians who don't examine fully their own ideas before presenting them...i actually like you and you bring ideas in which are able to be discussed in an open forum...i enjoy that...just that i get a little mouthy sometimes...and have been told that i am highly opinionated...could be a drawback from the job i do...

Newmania said...

You are not at all mouthy by blogasphere standards daisy

Daisy said...

thank you newmania and thank you for being patient with me...:)

CityUnslicker said...

what is very clear to me is that mass immigration is in many ways masking the social welfare problem.

Perhaps you have hit upon a reason as to why Labour is so tolerant of mass immigration; it wants to keep its voter serfs whilst improving the tax base to keep them happy?

Anonymous said...

I think we're looking at a bunch of old style Colonialists - and the country being colonised is England.

And who loved the colonies more than the Scots? They first formed a political vanguard, then began encouraging a great mass of, politically sympathetic, co-colonisers of other nationalities to come here too

Just as the early colonialists justified their invasion of other nations by claiming to be driven by ethical, even Christian, values and claimed their vile, paternalistic hegemony was good for the natives. So it is with nulab.

Scratch beneath the surface and it's all about, power and self enrichment.

The only way unaccomplished inadequates like Brown and Blair can get their hands on the riches, power and status they crave is through control and manipulation of us, the great unwashed of England - while they asset strip our country and sell it to the highest bidder. And the only way to gain such control is through the dark arts and a quasi-dictatorship.

Auntie Flo'

Anonymous said...

Missed off this bit:


And the road to that sort of domination is paved with welfare. Turning a significant strata of a once proud and independent people into Welfare dependents is perhaps one of the darkest arts of all.

Auntie Flo

Anonymous said...

I should have qualified that as nulab style welfare. I'm a firm believer in an adquate welfare state. Every country must have that.

Auntie Flo'

Anonymous said...

Everybody hits on the welfare state but lots of people using the system have already paid and still pay taxes,why not hitout on the Quangoes first, how much do they cost £100billion and get us out of the EU then look at welfare,but Cameron like the rest of them enjoys being in the trough,so he just like Brown will make sure they wont be touched as he will use them as sinicures for his mates,no I wont vote Brown or Cameron or whoever for the libdums ,I will do what Ive done since Thatcher,sit on my ar-e and watch tv when the next GE is on.

Ed said...

As I was saying to my flatmate the other day: it's all very well designing the best welfare system and writing it on a piece of paper. The question is how on earth do we get from here to there?

The moment a single person gets "done down" by any new system the government would cave in and grease the wheels - leaving us in exactly the same position as before.

Daisy said...

anon...i was always taught whenever you don't participate in the voting process that takes your voice away...so your bitching and moaning won't really count as you cant be bothered to move your arse to do anything to promote change...now will it...

electro-kevin said...

Welfare is at the root of all our ills.

Immigration would slow right down without it for a start.

Pugnacious yobs wouldn't be so arrogant if they knew that their behaviour would mean losing their livelihood.

Middle earners would keep more of their money and be able to go on proper holidays and out for meals which they can't afford to do this at the moment - not without cashing in their equity at any case. It seems wholly iniquitous that there is little material difference between a worker struggling on a 'good' income and one living on benefits as a lifestyle choice.

Have you noticed that 'poor' people often seem to be obese, smoke and have mobile phones glued to their ears ?

Regardless, this idea has no mileage while we have a glut of human rights lawyers making mischief. These 'professionals' are at the root of the burgeoning safety culture which is destroying our way of life too.

Take out the lawyers.

THEN you get your country back.

Newmania said...

I hardly thuink immigratuion is disguising problerms CU..It is disguising economic problems arguably but then emigration is making them a lot worse.

All in all it has been a bad thing and in any case i like the place the way it was. Its not as if 97 levels were low but they were sustainable whilst retaining the country.

Its numbers

Newmania said...

Flo- when I hear the arrogance of some people who come here and expect to have a special place for theri cultures at the expense of ours I am very much reminded of the arrognace of Victorian colonists ,


But then they had conquered the country and that was along time ago.

I wouldn1t want to become fascistic about it , its a mater of the number of epopole and what is expected of them. AS I say all those who wish to join the country are welcome , not those who hate it.

Whatever anyone publicly says they know that uit was most people feel

Newmania said...

The question is how on earth do we get from here to there?


ED what you say is profoundly true and I meant to make te point myself . cameron has talekd about a multi generational project and i think small increments are the only way. We cannot hang those tempted into the downward spiral to dry , we cannot leave people defenceless and the sheer numbers make the politics impossible .

It is not an easy questiona nd noone should pretend it is . The Wisconsin exmaple is interesting but you need tio look at the factors that were fdiffrent there to here( and as daisy says what they have done is far from perfect)

Newmania said...

EK did you see the " Where are they now 2on the chaps that killed Lawrence . None of them work and yet all of them magically have cars and money.

Now that is sickening and more common than the Liberal wou;ld know . They never go to the right places , they don`t know where they are

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